3- As for leadership, CCP never said they were commanding the fleets

6- It was very clear from the beginning that this was a pirate oriented event, seriously you didn't think that it was going to be staged in null? If you can't afford to lose it (even your ****** pod) don't undock.

Well

Economy wont get bigger without consuming resources.. And who will buy new shiny PVE ships If you dont loose them like this..

Hell, your losses will help New Eden economy to get bigger.

Support the Empires even after your death

Instead they basically funnelled everyone into goon space and sat back at their party and had a laugh.

I can see where people were upset about the tidi, the rally points should have been much closer than what they were but

You were all warned you would probably be killed yet you are still complaining about it. If you want to be a highsec carebear and not ever be killed, don't go to ******* nullsec.

Explain the logic of knowing you might be killed, getting killed, then getting mad at the person who told you that you might get killed

HTUF or GTFO

hello kitty online is that way ----------->

Everybody thought since it was CCP they'll protect you or somehow make all the null sec alliances disappear.

To put it simply we were all CPPd

This makes me glad that I just went **** it as soon as we were told to go to Ihal. Although it seems I would have missed all of that carnage anyway, having to jump 20+ systems at 10% TiDi in an Abaddon.

From what I've gathered in this thread, it seems a lot of people expected a rigged event in safe space where they hold back red crosses and achieve the objective easily.

It didn't happen.

It seems a lot of "I know there's danger out there but it doesn't affect me" bubbles were shattered in this event.

There was RP on the empire side, it just probably got drowned in spam.

Well, if they weren't expecting a cakewalk and were expecting to die, why the massive amounts of tears?

Because they were probably expecting dying in a fight against NPCs and PCC maned ships, not against a third party fleet.

Had they realized that they would have to fight against a null fleet, then they probably would have done things differently.
Perhaps not much better, admittedly, but at least they would have tried; here they were expecting a somewhat PvE event and ended in a PvP fight, they were more than likely ill-prepared.

What would be interesting to know is how many would have shown to the event and in what set-up if it was all about going against null seccers from the very start...

By taking the continuous high-ground your actually being a humongous hypocrite, because your quite happy to spam negative posts without really considering the possibility of a positive view.

The point was that people expected to get a fight, they did, it wasn't red crosses or ISD's which killed them, but the same result.

u can still loose it its not to late

1) Now tell me all about when you go to war in nullsec you prepare operations by slowboating a big fleet 23 jumps into hostile territory without intel.

2) Frankly, this has gone beyond old - I'm not gonna spend any more time trying to go through a wall of "I did not hear that" - no valid point has been made by the "HTFU" people regarding the trip or the event.

7h

. @RageRifter @Xtrah_ Communication is the key ingredient in any relationship, be it personal, business or gaming // @CCP_Falcon

now

@erlendur Interesting Tweet there. I wonder why @CCPGames are remaining so quiet about the rage that is going on right now then. #tweetfleet

Confirming Asbjrn is a very bad person.

That said, the announcement from CCP even said that it was likely to be dangerous and that there will be a retaliation.

Plus, we're not a third party. We were there for our serpentis bros. CFC + Serpentis = best friends forever <3

I had to LMAO of at this (Official EVE Comms as Twitter is now regarded as):



Interesting that that should be posted in the middle of a player rage-storm after they CCPd 2-3000 of us\them.

My response:

Hey, shooting someone and loving them isn't exactly mutually exclusive. "My little AHAC: Lasers are Magic".

Also, it's weekend. They're probably not at work atm, we'll hear from them on monday.

-Usual can't be arsed reading crap-post

Compared to you sir, I'm a ******* saint!

That said, I think I can see where this will go - CCP will announce the incompetence of fleet commanders as purposeful. The empires are bad for you: they tried to gather your help for a last, desperate push against an enemy they couldn't break themselves. They failed, big time - underestimating the capability and will of nullsec entities to defend their territories. Overestimating their ability to organize attacks.

It's pointless to put artificial borders between "roleplay event" and actual history that happened. It wasn't a bunch of griefers ruining an event for their sick amusement. Sure, rear ends of many people met the boot at muzzle velocity that night but... likely many of those who administered the smacking were on the receiving end many, many times.

A lot of that wasn't fair either - bombed off the field because FC didn't pay attention, slam into a bubble and get pipebombed without a chance to fight back, it's how things go. You trust a commander to lead you to victory and safety and sometimes he fails. So don't scream at CCP about not making this a themepark ride but an uphill walk in snow. Look at it from the perspective of history that was made that day. Victory or loss don't matter - it's all about fun.

There won't be another day like this. Whatever side you were on, you participated in a unique event that won't repeat itself. You helped shape the lore of the world while playing the game. The only people who really lost weren't those who died or didn't make it to the staging system - they were those who quit or didn't attend.

Think how awesome the fact is that you supported the faction you liked against the odds, struggling to reach the target against incompetence of your leaders and lack of information. If CCP intended to get you all there in one piece, they'd have teleported people or spawned an NPC titan with infinite stront and fuel to bridge everyone easily. They chose not to.

(Also dear CCP can we get "I supported the Serpentis... AND THEN - BETRAYAL!" t-shirts? Or at least something to commemorate the outcome of the event.)

Myth busted
Many players believe the bar to entry in PvP is having 500 battleships and a pocket full of Titans,and end up avoiding it entirely. This event showed that anyone with a few good friends, decent fleet comps, good comms, and a solid FC, can absolutely tear the a$$ out of far bigger and more powerful fleets.

It should encourage people to PvP, not discourage them. Had a 1000 newbies been able to dominate just because of numbers, the myth of blobbing being the state of PvP would have been verified. Instead, all the blob in the world couldn't save the high sec fleets.
Take heart in that- PvP is not something out of reach of anyone but giant alliances. It's absolutely within the reach of even die hard care bears with more alts than friends.

Now you understand how nullsec players feel anytime there's a massive tidi battle and ccp kills the node and resets all progress, wasting almost 5-7 days of effort by all the players involved.

Just dropping in to say thanks for giving us this feedback. We haven't had time to go through it all yet, but we will be doing so as a team and taking a lot of points on board to shape our work in the future. We will also be explaining some things to clear up some misunderstandings we have been noticing. Thanks for your time and patience.

It actually happened during the accidental "Q9PP" thing. CCP accidentally remapped the Z9PP node due to a typo in the script, trapped capitals wound up free and the battle ended right there.

In the attempt to improve the overall fight quality and node stability in the Z9PP system at 22:41 UTC by moving away all non-critical services from this node, our engineers unfortuntely made a mistake and actually moved the critical system from the current server node instead of moving all other systems. As result every pilot in this system lost connection to the node and therefore to Tranquility.

The system Z9PP is online and accessible again now.

It is extremely unfortunate to make such a mistake and we apologize deeply for disrupting one of the truly epic battles in the history of EVE; especially since this battle already raged on for several hours and was still heating up for more! We are very sorry about this incident and will make sure that such mistakes won't happen again.

[--Now I know you didn't actually read my post.

Did you not notice the same quotation marks to denote sarcasm that you yourself just friggin used? Seriously? Literally used quotes to mock something I just used quotes to mock.

It's weekend and they only work mon-fri unless there's an emergency.

And no, this mess isn't an emergency.

So to summarise on my previous point of the incident relating to Z9PP and drawing comparisons to this incident:

Incident regarding Z9PP:

@2013.07.04 22:45 Rage thread opened
@2013.07.04 23:06 initial apology
less than 1.5 hours after this event a Tweet apology
@2013.07.04 23:31 40 minutes after his initial apology and CCP Phantom again apologises
@2013.07.04 23:44 Another from CCP Phantom
@Posted: 2013.07.05 00:40 CCP Falcon closes the thread and redirects to official apology thread.

So in comparison we have heard nothing apart from a "Yeah, we might look into this, thanks for your feedback" from CCP but when they do the same thing to Null Sec you get the above timeline? That thread was 32 pages long before it was locked and the official apology and explanation posted in less than 2 hours from it being opened.

How they managed the fallout from Z9PP was so much better than this and I cannot describe how badly this "LIVE Event" and aftermath has been handled. This is now over 54 hours and on-going and what have we heard?

Sorry guys I have to say something with all this talk about desubbing.

First of all this was incompetence, but also one has to look at the issue around these events being over-subscribed, one of the issues was that the nodes appears not to have been reinforced which is of course poor planning on their part. CCP need to confirm whether they were reinforced or not.

The location of the mustering system was incompetent, it was obvious that these events do have a large following, so placing this so far from the target systems was plain stupid. CCP need to apologise for that. Most people are quite rightly upset about jumping around in 10% TiDi for hours and not arriving at the location of the event before it ended. This is the issue!

In terms of the location of the event and the Curse one being next to the CFC staging systems, this is incompetence, however there is a perceived slant by CCP to the 0.0 cartels, which makes it look and feel like a setup, perhaps CCP should think about explaining the decision around the location of the Curse event, knowing that the CFC was deployed there. Even with the CCP slant towards 0.0 entities, I cannot believe or accept that this was a setup by CCP, it makes no sense whatsoever to do that to what is a major part of their customer base.

Also the secrecy and lack of communication may be explained by the fact that certain 0.0 entities go out of their way to attack these events.

My conclusion was that it was a major error on the part of CCP in execution and planning.

Also there are a number of 0.0 players on this thread throwing oil onto the fire, some of them really need to step away from this because any reasonable person can see that there was a valid issue with this event and it is not tears over lost ships.

Some are some are waiting a little longer to see how this plays out,We will see.

Generally most players in high sec are not there because they joined the game and decided I do not want to move here or there, nor are they afraid of going to null. Typically it has been more about playing commitment. High sec is a very appealing area for those who like small casual play styles.

- No sov to worry about holding
- No need to defend your space
- Less attention needed to do activities, thus allowing you to multi-task
- No bubbles or bombs to slow down your playing
- Access to major trade hubs allowing trading and market play
- Level 4 missions
- Helping or assisting newer players
- Access to lore

These are the things that appeals to high sec players, null sec requires a more intense approach to playing and limits the factors that appeals to social game play. Not all null space is this way, and fortunately recently has become less like it as well. CCP is focusing more toward small scale game play. We can see this with the mobile structures for instance. Giving players the ability to poke each other in the eye and get under each other's skin.

I would say that high sec players are more relaxed and tend to play more casually with less impact on the choices they make. Null sec players like that. It certainly has nothing to do with fear of the space...just the type of game play played. This is why people often shift around between high, low, null, and wh depending on how often and how much energy they wish to put into the game.

The live events team and others are probably having a proper debrief, as you've said. If you are wanting a proper response, give them time to do so.

Also, consider this. Yes the TiDi was ****, and travelling many jumps through it was ****, and getting massacred at the end was, you guessed it, ****, just pause for a minute. You could have stopped travelling after the first couple of 10% TiDi jumps, you could have given up before you jumped into lowsec, and before you jumped into null, and you could have went and did something else.

I'm not excusing the fact that you were led through an experience that left you disatisfied, and could have been planned better (my earlier posts agree that you Empire folks had a poorer time of it), but just take the time to realise that you could have gotten off the failtrain and did something else. There is a bit of personal responsability that you have to take here.

Of course, it will be a minor miracle if the rabblerabble brigade realises this rather than sperging, but you never know.

Hal.

If there is only one thing that has me miffed about this, it can be this:

We have seen CCP work with in-game organizations before. The latest "scandal" was with Somer Blink and we need not go into that (and what anybody thinks about it, scandal or not, etc)..

So if CCP will go to in-game organizations and work with them for some promotional or program, then why did they not approach FCORD, SYNE, IRED, and some of the other RP-related organizations for this live event?

It wouldn't even have requiring any "giving" of ships. FCORD came into existence just because of the Sansha live events (as I recall).

Did the unholy screeching outrage over Somer Blink suddenly make CCP extremely averse to working with any player-run orgs? Did they have a policy change because of it, so such level that their hands were tied for this live event (and hence the lack of organization)?

Yup they did, and had a blast. They even managed to reach the Serpentis station (one of them even brought his Vindicator for Glorious Death! ) You can find the FCORD report here: Impression of a large fleet . It's one of the more positive threads on the event (focuses on the action itself, not the CCP screwups) Edit: to clarify, this is the action viewpoint of the highsec players, wich seems okay for both sides.

There were some yellow instructions in Sarum prime local buried in mass spam who all moved out of amarr for the day, but some of those were trolling in game links ,there was one that appeared more genuine, so after seeing the same in twitter, I thought what the hell I will not get anything done waiting here.so pretty much the same experience as you.Never saw a CCP post at all.Sorry I missed you, would have been good to be in a fleet, but in the end It was over before I even got there.

The goal of the event was to reach each of the pirate facilities. Common sense says that if the NPC leader reaches the facility and attacks and destroys...or his fleet wipes, its game over. If you are 4 jumps behind the primary CCP fleet and under 10% TiDi thats roughly what....20 minutes at best travel time. Plenty of time to take down a bloody flimsy pirate structure don't you think? I formed up in Sarum and when the tweet went out to mobilize to Ihal, I followed it. I never waited for conformation of information.

As a result I arrived in Ihal around 18:47 which is the same time I joined the coordinator fleet. The coordinator formed fleet in that system, and posted in fleet chat 19:14 that we would move out at 19:20. I was screaming in the events channel to move to Ihal and still had people going no...I refuse to move till CCP tells me in game.

At 20:22 he stated "Alright, I think there's enough of us now." I don't know about you mate, but that is usually a clue to me they have begun engaging the facility. Typically if you are 4 jumps out you are NOT going to make it in time. If you are further you still wouldnt.

RVB was engaging the goonies in Doril which was 3 out I think? When I spoke to someone in RVB they said they engaged to make room for the 5-6 fleets that were 3-4 jumps behind THEM. If you follow the timeline then it is usually an indicator that the event will be over before you get there. They aren't going to hang around for 3 hours waiting on people who refused to move to ihal when they should have and instead stayed in Sarum...having fore knowledge that we WOULD be heading toward Utopia which was 28ish jumps from Sarum to begin with.

Yes there was some communication and organizational issues, but judging from the reaction of those in the coordinator fleet, they honestly had no ******* clue what was going on and that only made the issue worse. The worst part of this was the FC was giving detailed commands, but people were so busy spamming...whoa man this TiDi is trippy and too excited to STFU enough to see commands so they got left behind and pissed when they got there and it was over.

Here is a nice blog / news about this.

http://aurora-arcology.blogspot.be/2013/11/capsuleers-respond-en-masse-to-call-for.html

Absolutely not; however, when someone in those channels says there is a tweet about moving to Ihal, you could at least take all of about 5 seconds to look to confirm it was indeed from eve twitter. I noticed at least 3 channels that not only posted the exact text of the tweets, but also posted the link to the tweet in channel too. Just click, read, close in game browser and move.

Well....that is fine for testing purposes because it isn't actual game play. I surmise the majority of people in channels spamming and shooting friendlies was because they wanted to disrupt and ruin the event. Lets face it, eve players are dicks like that. It may be frustrating, but to lock chats to allow only CCP to dictate who can speak and who cant destroys this opportunity to wreck an event. We may think that isn't a big deal, but in a sandbox game where you can literally do ANYTHING...it rather is.

brilliant move by CCP, +1

As i am sure they will confirm. EVERYTHING went as planned.

all part of the storyline, they will tell you.

every pilot who went out on this doomed fleet is going to be a lore hero,

i would not be surprised if you find a floating monument with all the names of the pilots who died on that fateful fleet anchored in space right after downtime on the 19th of this month.

rubicon is coming and if your p*ssing and moaning about this your going to have a full on fit when the heavy crap arrives. new dynamic system security ...hisec shrinking, exploding losec incursions faction navies ignore the cries of victims shouting for justice. and so much more. save your tears and your rage for whats coming.

as to why CCP has kept silent, they dont need to say anything your all doing it for them. Be happy Be proud you were there. for every winner there has to be losers and guess what this time it was you lot, next time.....you decide.

new dynamic system security ...hisec shrinking, exploding losec incursions faction navies ignore the cries of victims shouting for justice. and so much more. save your tears and your rage for whats coming.

To be more accurate, your subscription is costing more using PLEX...only you aren't paying cash for it, someone else is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-L0PZGN3XI

The only thing which suprises me is the utter retardness of people thinking "hey lets send a good 2000 high sec carebears to a system in null sec. WHAT COULD POSSIBLY GO WRONG?"

-snipped for clarity-

It sucks that your time was wasted. At least you got to sort-of make a mark, and have a (not very complimentary) story to tell other people about Eve and CCP. How many ages would you have to play another MMORPG in order to get a story like this, even if you were they butt of the joke?

But that's the game, it's what you pay for or choose not to pay for. An awful lot of people have chosen not to pay for it, which maybe should be pause for thought for CCP.

Further to the above people spent their RL time (even taking time of work so they could participate) jumping through that 10% TiDi in the hope to add content, experience something unique and make it to the destination to participate not to have CCP end the event by blowing the objective before most of the fleets had arrived.

It seems that CCP may very well just be spending all their time on the most recent scandal rather than addressing this one or they be in heavy debriefing sessions. No response on here or Twitter (OFC as this is the new official communications for EVE Online). Those that want to view the latest and what "Customer Support over the course of the weekend re-investigated" while we are still awaiting a further update response view this. It may amuse you while you wait another day or so

Nice Job CCP. Now Can We All Get 17m Free Skillpoints Also?

GÇÅ@CCP_Goliath

Interested in this #tweetfleet? Empire navies put out call for capsuleer assistance. http://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/world-news/empire-navies-put-out-call-for-capsuleer-assistance/ GǪ #eveonline

[quote=Maximus Aerelius via Twitter] GÇÅ@CEOMCMXD 0151

@CCP_Goliath Customers put out call for @CCPGames to respond https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=293869 GǪ #tweetfleet #eveonline #CCPd #CCPCustomerConcerns

Bookmarking this spot for this:



In reply just now:

GÇÅ@CCP_Goliath 10m

@CEOMCMXD @CCPGames already said we are responding - said it on Friday

CCP Goliath GÇÅ@CCP_Goliath 9m

@CEOMCMXD @CCPGames actually, responding is the wrong choice, the team is releasing a devblog on the event. This would have happened anyway

I believe I speak for a large number of players here when I say
I am bemused by your curt response on Twitter!

Your tone gives the impression that you are annoyed or irritated
by our raising of a legitimate grievance.

You seem perturbed that we have dared to question your authority,
except that we did not.

We (perhaps blindly) followed you in to what turned out to be a
slaughter of the innocents and all we have asked is why?

Considering that a large number of us essentially pay your wages,
does this not entitle us to a small post in the thread to, at the very
least, acknowledge our greivances?

As this thread is showing no signs of abating , perhaps you could
stem it by stating when your Dev Blog on the matter will be published?

So I think I got this. Ccp did an event in turn it lead to null sec .
20 odd jumps were made in time di
Every one ended up dead befor they could get there so event ended so
Why o why are you all so up set. Because you did not get to do the event.
And that was cos no one made it.

Or was it the fact u had to do jumps in slow motion
What ever it was I think a bit of perspective is needed here
You don't like doing a load of jumps my god then why do you play eve ?

While I agree with the above snip I would like to draw your attention to the IG complaints that have been raised time and again in this threadnaught:

CCP knew full well that TiDi would be in effect for those travelling to the waypoints and that they would have 23 jumps to go through and that the Null Blocs would either Titan Bridge in forces or that they were already in-situ.
CCP either by ignorance or incompetence took or tried to take 2-3000 paying customers into a massive staging area of Null Block
CCP then declared the event over after an hour knowing full well that participants were still in TiDi and travelling or getting torn apart by the Null Bloc.
CCP employees in the role of FC\Actor\Guide wilfully commanded scores of players to jump into Null.
CCP employees in the role of FC\Actor\Guide either jumped ahead of the fleet using devhacks or dropped fleet leaving the participants in disarray (This requires verification but I have heard it from several sources)

IRL issues\complaints\concerns:

CCP did not deliver on what was advertised to a large audience.
CCP did not estimate the numbers of attendees correctly. This was probable due to the headlines of "Unique" and "never to be repeated"
CCP did not organise any sort of reliable communications or clearly communicate to the participants where, when, how they should be.
CCP wilfully withheld key information that would've enabled participants to make other ways to get to the rendezvous points as we know that players are resourceful. It wasn't hard for Null Blocs to organise as they had 50mins notice. Withholding this information just served to add confusion to the unaware participants not yet exposed to fleets etc
CCP used Twitter to communicate of staging system change.
CCP has refused to acknowledge bar one comment from CCP Goliath that this thread exists
CCP has refused to update it's customer of what is occurring or if this is being discussed or analysed
CCP has refused to indicate if any update will be forthcoming
CCP has allowed this to get to the point where people are unsubscribing\not renewing\cancelling from the game due to the perceived level of incompetence, collusion with Null Sec Cartels, contempt that CCP hold towards the Hi-Sec player and the tinfoil hattery that even I am starting to wonder "well what if".
CCP are supposed to be a trusted entity in EVE Online. If you cannot trust those that develop the game and run it who can you trust.
CCP are supposed to be an impartial and independent body removed from the universe of New Eden and so removed from a conflict of interest.

CCP were not expected to:

Hand hold the participants
Ensure participants were in suitable ships
Ensure participants had blank clones
Ensure participants had an up-to-date clone
Tell people how to operate in a fleet

The above are my conclusions and mine alone and are my own opinions as well. Now if you compare the response time to paying customers legitimate concerns regarding this event to that of the Null Bloc with the Z9PP incident you can see why some of us are so very concerned. Z9PP was firstly apologised for within 30 minutes of the rage thread being posted and apologies continued a further 2 or more times and a full report published and thread closed within 2 hours. This also happened on a Thursday night and so did the "CTA Event".

Draw from that what you will but this is not about me losing anything IG as I didn't.

If anything, the New Player Training : Teamwork later today should be interesting
in light of recent events? Perhaps the Live event should have taken place after this?
Just a thought CCP, or maybe you can run it again?

There are trolls who do it so much better than you though,
Although practice is helpful, it may be better to read and learn from some of the more experienced ones.

Remember it is far better to be thought a fool than open one's mouth and prove it.

Folks, two things of note.

Supposedly, if CCP Goliath's tweets are to be believed, CCP is releasing a dev blog about the Live Event. When, no one knows, given how exhausted they are from high fiving each other and the null sec cartel leadership at last week's party where they live streamed the carnage.

Secondly, on Thursday, numerous CCP employees will be on twitch TV to gloat over all the changes they are making to the game with Rubicon. But the big one will be the direction of the game that will be presented by seagull. Expect to hear a lot about high sec being dismantled.

GÇÅ@CEOMCMXD 7h

@CCP_Goliath /Cloak. I appreciate the update & "communication is the key ingredient in any relationship" @erlendur . Any ETA? #tweetfleet

GÇÅ@CCP_Goliath 2h

@CEOMCMXD @erlendur It's under review just now, so whenever that gets cleared I guess.

GÇÅ@CEOMCMXD 1h

Marvellous, thank you for this update @CCP_Goliath, it is appreciated. #tweetfleet #eveonline

I am really sorry, I try to understand the details on a a twitter stream but not too clear to me, Is CCP goliath promising a response today?

If high sec players want to stand up for their playstyle and defend it, they need to get organized. That means getting into big alliances, fighting back in game, but it also means getting their own representatives on the CSM and influence CCP. There is no other way to protect the "free trade" and "more less safe environment for manufacturing".

Come on now, we've got what we wanted. They've been so kind as to acknowledge our existence.

Now let's let them work and see what they come up with before restarting ;)

It is good to hear we will have some news tomorrow. I think people were too angry to have a bit of patience over such a delicate issue. Ive noticed some going off topic and even ISD removing some comments. I would hope any one else who post will be a bit more civilized. It is a game after all folks :D

Absolutely, now we have crisis management back on track. Great news.

Of course CCP deserve the time to investigate, discuss, and resolve the issues.
We welcome the fact that they heard there was something to look at.

It is on us now to stand behind them to help them resolve any issues where it in our power to do so.
If they ask us for help to offer suggestion, we will help.

It is in ALL our interests for this game to succeed,

Let All groups work towards this and not take advantage to push our region or blocks agendas.

For some this is spreadsheets in space, for some battle, for some building something in a new environment,or the thrill of exploration and for others role play

That is why we still have EVE where others have fallen.

Lets support the fact that it is a game we all can play, in our own style, with respect for the others choices. And honour that original concept.

It is not a game where one side has to lose for another to win.

All can win.

GÇÅCommunication is the key ingredient in any relationship, be it personal, business or gaming

To be fair to CCP they used to post much more quickly (when they posted, which wasn't always) but often not necessarily the most well considered posts (e.g. Summer of RAGE and pouring nitroglycerin on the inferno). Now they mostly have a process which includes bouncing dev blogs off the CSM and generally vetting them for content more closely before throwing them to the piranhas. I mean players. All of this takes time.

Whether or not that process works here is why they invented popcorn.

Here is your long awaited explanation http://community.eveonline.com/news/news-channels/world-news/empires-led-capsuleer-assault-on-pirates-ends-in-failure/

Did they actually say they would release a dev blog and not just a news article?

GÇÅ@CCP_Goliath 12 Nov

@CEOMCMXD @CCPGames actually, responding is the wrong choice, the team is releasing a devblog on the event. This would have happened anyway

Hi! Yeah the news is not the statement I promised

That's just something we tend to do post-event as a matter of course. Blog should be coming this afternoon.

Not to mention gagging comms in an event seems counter-intuitive to the spirit of eve's freedom of action.

To deny the ability to disrupt events via chatting in the fleet chat or whatever is at the core of being able to disrupt it. CCP is a neutral entity in the game so are the empires. They do not favor one type of player over the other be it to assist in the event or wreck it. Thus the logical course of action would be to not bother with gagging of official comms. Player comms yes...because we have our own agendas that determine if we want to fight for a particular alliance or something. We intentionally blow each other up under a one sided mentality. CCP must remain completely neutral and provide both the opportunity to make the event successful as well as the opportunity to completely wreck it as well.

Communication is key to any success we have already established that a few pages back. Thus if you disrupt communication lines you ruin the success. Isolating the official comms from that goal impedes upon that goal. I for one don't like it...but I understand that it is necessary.

I mean telling thousands of players to travel 20jumps over unhardened nodes. what the heck did you THINK was going to happen? That is what I'd like an answer to.

7 Nov

Apologies for all the lag and tidi guys. We have tons of systems reinforced, including Sarum Prime and other systems. #tweefleet

There have been thousands of people reading and posting and tens of thousands reading with great interest.

Condescending, insulting, ad hominmen.... anything else you want to use besides rational discussion?

Now all that unpleasantness is out of the way,lets move on ISD will do their job in the morning and tidy things up.

lets assume that we get a good response tomorrow and continue our discussion on that basis.

There were some good suggestions that got buried in the flood, so I'd like to bring one up for discussion.
sorry to the original author, I thought it was great, but I couldn't find the original. sorry.

One idea related to a Titan crashing into a planet, and a great disaster occurring.
the idea suggested making a POPup mission around it where agents issued a choice of missions.this can last for a period.
These could relate to PI mining Manufacturing, Hauling, couriering, medical aid, missioning to retrieve needed materials, Exploring for lost treasures and victims etc etc. Maybe retrieving lost components from factional warfare sites to enable a PvP aspect.

All to enable the rescue efforts and rebuilding the planet.

Instead of simply doing meaningless grinds in pi/mining/industry we can make a difference.

These efforts can instead go into the rescue effort and we can see the rebirth of a Planet.
There will be a role for everyone here.
There is a role for PvP and PvE events, but an idea to step outside that box.
And we will then feel when we are there next time.
yeah I did something good that week.

Worth building on?
any other good ideas we can offer?

Dev Blog posted here: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/operation-spectre-event-breakdown-and-faq/

And the verdict is?

Dev Blog posted here: http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/operation-spectre-event-breakdown-and-faq/

Personally, take a moment and it is a stunning reversal ... From the silence.

So yes when everything I could have wished for and more is given to us i think it was a good job.

After this,How we got here, is much less important than where we are going.

-Usual Trii Seo venom spouting and misreading-

Oh, and since it was requested to be back, mandatory: HTFU!

Inclusion of both Hi-Sec, Low and Null type of play styles is always good but you have to bear in mind that going into Null with a "Kitchen Sink" fleet is always going to end the way that this event did and by that I mean you are handing essentially risk free kills and CONCORD Bounty Payments to those in Null (unless they are countered by another Null Entity who chose that time to attack them which would lead to some very interesting developments).

I think they might've expected us to rain on the pirate parade and literally kill everything flying instead of letting the pirates win.

- Stream the event LIVE from CCP Headquarters -

That wouldn't really cause our FCs to scramble and try to reach the target. It'd be more like "Welp, seems like we got shafted by CCP gentlemen." with the decisions that followed mostly guided by how far off target are we. Shooting people is fun, but if things end before we can arrive we'll just go home and treat it as yet another case of 'blueballs'. Disappointing but it happens. It's not an R64 or a CSAA to rush to defend it at all costs - while the operation "let's punch CONCORD in their spacehorse" had people attend it, it wasn't strategic.

Titans cost ISK and risk to run, they have limited bridge range, require a fleet being in system so a mis-bridge would cost us fuel, time to return and reposition or time to burn. Does this sound like :effort:? It kind of is :effort:, unless people want to have fun at all cost the fleet will likely burn home.

Why burn home? Because the only really mobile bridging ship is a Black Ops. With short-lasting nearly undetectable cynos (can still get probed down) and costing only around a billion (or less if it's a basic pig fit) it can be dropped about to move a sneaky squad. A Titan costs... last killboard numbers put it at eighty times that + fittings, though I heard they went down a tad since then. To bridge a fleet back you'd need to deploy a safe tower, jump in a titan (without the fleet knowing - there may be real spies about), bridge the fleet back, jump back the titan. It costs fuel, stront, and is too damn risky.

People should, instead of relying on CCP to give them an easy taxi (yes, I get it, riding a Titan bridge rocks. They should let people experience it, the first time you do it it's awesome. They should also have a CCP Dev commit the most common Titan Pilot mistake. The wrong button, please do press it.) and weaken the defenders for them - start organizing themselves.

No titan? Get into a corporation that owns a Titan. CCP provides a Titan bridge? Good - get into a squad of your own folk, set up a doctrine, get some logis, maybe a booster. Get at least someone who knows his spaceships to call primaries, organize and move together. Learn. Don't ask to be spoonfed fun, go punch a bear and rip the fun out of his bloodied guts.

As full of chestbeating, dickwaving and overall "Hooga booga, we best, we best!" we are, getting an alliance fleet up and running and reliably using it to smack someone about isn't as easy as it sounds. Each thing that benefits the fleet and increases its chances of success is an investment - Titans and appropriate pilots for them need to be purchased/built. Everyone can FC in theory but in practice fleet FCs - especially good fleet FCs - are valuable assets.

Asking CCP to punish people who exert control over certain space because of their experience and gathered assets in this situation is an idea so bad it folds in on itself, becomes good and then plunges again to bad. It breaks the sandbox to create a themepark: "are you tall enough to ride THE TITAN?!".

just a thought, the event fed a bunch of us hi-sec folks to battle-hardened combat pilots en-masse which was basically a turkey shoot and I can't imagine it was really that much fun for the null-sec folks (where was the challenge?)

If they did this the other way around however with limited flow of null-sec fleets getting through to hi-sec to plunder an empire base *that* could be interesting, the advantage of the better pilot skills/ships of the null-seccers would be mitigated by the numbers of hi-sec folks waiting for them.

I'm not thinking of a way to feed null-secs into a grinding mill here, everything else I have previously said about random insert points etc (easily done with a worm-hole exit point whipping around in hi-sec. This would however give the hi-secs a chance to be organized and test the null-secs skills against much bigger fleets than usual. This would also spread combat across many systems to ease TiDi effects. Would make more sense in lore terms to, with capsuleer incursions into empire space.

With that you would essentially be telling people in whatever system to either join in or GTFO while the LE is in progress. Once you get Null Bloc entities into Hi-Sec (I'm not saying that they don't get in now) but imagine if you will -10's being granted a "safe time passage" to Hi-Sec and the carnage they could do if they ignored the LE Fleet\Objective and went on a rampage instead.

Just something to consider.

just trying to think of better ways to run these events that can include everyone but in a more balanced way

I'm new so have never seen these events before, however there has to be a better way to stage them as feeding hi-secs into null is going to result in lots and lots of dead hi-sec clones...even if you survived whats the chance of a hi-sec egetting back through null with a full cargo hold when the route is known in advance?

Makes it pointless for the hi-secs to join.

There also need to be other kinds of events, EVE isn't just about combat. A large part of the player base will be explorers/miners/industrials. These should be catered for too. Ghost sites will be like mini events from what I've seen but will be rare and you will need to be skilled/lucky to gain from them. This I think will benefit the already rich and skilled players far more. Events should be created for all levels of players to maintain balance.

Corraidhin and Maximus.

I am pretty sure it is clear that when CCP do "bite size" events they can go really well.
it is the giant game-spanning events which involve thousands that have the potential (and often/always do) turn into Gigantic clusterfracks.

One lesson I hope is being learned is that trying to use the existing tools and trying to control thousands of disparate players with totally different expectations is just not going to end well.

Your Ideas (and mine) regarding breaking the events into small mini events hit the mark ,giving everyone a chance to do something, ie. mining manufacturing etc etc leading to a major final conflict, that CCP limit the numbers to either by players succeeding at the mini-events and earning a right of entry or the result of all of the mini-events deciding the size.

The other option is to run a week long event, that players enter and it concludes a week later, seperate from normal space running on separate equipment.
CCP creates a sandbox with separate rules and rewards to normal EvE and it is up to the players as to what they make of it.
player behavior will determine the result. And if it Fracks up tzhe players did it to themselves.
I posted thoughts earlier that give more details. https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=3878026#post3878026

CCP can do either or both of these but the live events as they stand, are just setting themselves up for disaster.

I really like the idea of multiple smaller events giving access to a final event based on previous success, means anyone can take part and those that prove their worth can get into the final area, with the greater rewards it brings...would give a much greater sense of achievement I think.

Large events should only be in response to player driven events like the one that made the news...though CCP would just love to recreate it they can't as it isn't possible to forcibly organize large groups of people. The massive battle that took place did so because two major combatants organized themselves...

regular events culminating in mid-scale fleet battles/research/explo would be much better for everyone and could run much more often

Or, maybe, just maybe, people should stop expecting to be told "you are venturing into the danger zone, wear your hard hat" and start thinking for themselves. We actually didn't expect empire people to be rerouted our way - thinking CCP organized a full-fledged safe rat turkey shoot for carebears.

Heh, go figure - people get welped into the wall and instead of thinking what they could do to avoid in the future they demand others to do something instead.